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stroker rotating assembly or top end build?

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******* SPACESTATION
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am thinking about going stock with the rotating assembly (for longevity) and going more modified with the top end. Cam, R/T heads, 1.6:1 roller rockers, ram air hood.

The cost of the stroker kit is $1600 stroker kit includes:
Scat crankshaft and I beam Rods
Diamond Racing Forged Pistons & RINGS (multiple comp ratios, stock up to 10.5:1)
Clevitte - 77 rods and main

The top end build would be $1659
Comp Cams 312/218 $339
Harland Sharp 1.6:1 roller rockers S70036 $309
Roller lifters P5249862 $111.25
R/T Heads $900

which would make more power?
Which would be more reliable in relation to longevity?
 

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'75 Power Wagon
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If you are only playing with that budget.. just do the top end...

If you plan on doing the stroker, you are gonna do the top end in addition to the stroker... and go with a bigger cam.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
If you are only playing with that budget.. just do the top end...

If you plan on doing the stroker, you are gonna do the top end in addition to the stroker... and go with a bigger cam.
If i did the stroker, the top end was going to be stock, minus a larger cam to let it breath.
 

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'75 Power Wagon
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well... thats what im saying... doing the stroker and leaving the stock top end wouldnt help it breath! Do the top end first... and then down the road you can stroke it out. But looking at that list you don't actually plan on much of a port & polish on the heads, you just plan on buying a set of r/t heads?

Cause, with a stroker... you really need to have some port work done to the heads to make it run to its potential.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I see what you are saying, but wouldn't a cam with a set of R/T heads help it breath better?
I don't have enough in the rebuild budget to do both.
But I'm thinking if I increase the displacement it will get me more power. And with a stroker kit, a longer stroke would give me more low end torque, which is what I'm after.
I'm concerned that if I do a top end build it will make it a high rpm motor, which is not what I want.

I would still get some gains with a stroker, cam and stock heads right?
Increasing the displacement from 318 to 390 would get me closer to my goal of 300 hp.
And I could get heads down the road a lot easier than I could get a new rotating assembly installed.
Heads would take 1 full saturday. New rotating assembly would probably require pulling the motor. Might be able to do it in the truck, but wouldn't be easy.
 

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Based on your budget I dont feel stroking to lower end and leaving the stock heads would be worthwhile. If your going to stroke the lower end you need a stout top end to reach the motors full potential.

First I would do a compression and a leak down check on the motor to see what condition your motor is in right now. If the lower end is tight which hopefully it is then I would build yourself a nice top end.

The R/T heads dont really flow to good for what your paying. You would be better off buying a set of the Magnum HD heads which flow better than R/T heads out of the box and they cost less.

Then get yourself a nice cam/valve spring package. Cut down the runners and divider in the intake. Install a throttle body and have the PCM reflashed which you will need either way with the mods. You will spend in the neighborhood of $1500 and have a really nice motor.

Do you currently have a 318 or a 360?
 

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His sig has 5.2. 318
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Then get yourself a nice cam/valve spring package. Cut down the runners and divider in the intake. Install a throttle body and have the PCM reflashed which you will need either way with the mods. You will spend in the neighborhood of $1500 and have a really nice motor.

Do you currently have a 318 or a 360
I have a 5.2, already have a 52mm throttle body, and the PCM will be flashed shortly after Christmas.

I realize the stroker kit won't reach it's full potential until I get heads & cam, BUT I can install heads later much easier than a new rotating assembly, and get the PCM flash updated for $200.
This project / upgrade is intended for when the motor is due for a rebuild, not immidiately.
I am wanting massive amounts of torque from this mod, that is why I am hesitant about buying heads without knowing what they are designed for.
That is the reason I will not buy an M1 intake, they perform in the higher RPM range.

From what I have heard thus far, looks like there isn't an option 1 or 2, rather both.
 

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'75 Power Wagon
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with doing a stroker kit, you cant just buy only a stroker kit, stick it in... and not pay anything else... you will have to pay to bore the block, clearance the rod bolts in every cylinder... and plan on spending a lot more than just the stroker kit.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
with doing a stroker kit, you cant just buy only a stroker kit, stick it in... and not pay anything else... you will have to pay to bore the block, clearance the rod bolts in every cylinder... and plan on spending a lot more than just the stroker kit.
Not to sound like a smart ass, but I have thought of that already, see the list below:

So, from www.stokerkits.com we have:

$1600 for stroker kit includes:
Scat crankshaft and I beam Rods
Diamond Racing Forged Pistons & RINGS (multiple comp ratios, stock up to 10.5:1)
Clevitte - 77 rods and main

If I bore it out .020 over, it will increase displacement from 318 to 390.

These are the rest of the parts I need to complete the rebuild:

$1885 total misc parts & labor listed below.

The balancing will probably be skipped as I don’t plan on revving past 5,000 anyway.
And with a stroker, it will be more of a low end torque monster than a high revving hp motor.

Melling High Volume Oil Pump $37.99
MP timing chain tensioner DCC=5007709 $38.99 Cheaper at the dealer.
Double roller timing chain set P5249267 $58.75
Intake plenum cover kit 7714 $80.50
MP Valve springs P4876062>
MP Chrome molly retainers P4452032>
MP Locks P4529218>
Springs, Retainers & Locks $216

Valves??

Comp Cams 312/218 $339
lifters $135
Harland Sharp roler rockers S70036 $309
Roller lifters P5249862 $111.25

Gasket set P4876249 112.50
Intake bolt set P4876772 $6.25

Machine work
Bore block typical cost $160
Hot tank and new cam bearing typical cost $70
Heads, 3-angle valve job $200
*Balancing $145-200 depending on who you call

Total rebuild will cost somewhere around $3000 - $3500.

edit: and I can clearance the rods myself, seen another member perform that task with a dremel and a couple stones. Took him about 45 minutes.
 

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Hughes Performance sells the Magnum HD heads and also has the flow data on their website. It shows the comparison between the stock Magnum's, the R/T and the Magnum HD heads.

Check out their website.
 

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i would stray away from the r/t heads since they will more than likely be as prone to the hairline cracks as the stock magnum heads......


im not sure how you want to undergo this project,but i would seriously consider buying a junker 360 block and build off of it until everything is to your liking and then drop it in......

i started just wanting to go with the stroker kit but i ended up in the same perdicament took 7 months worth of buying parts/machinest work/etc to get everything back in and running doing things in my free time after work.....


It most definantly worth it though i like being able to tap the gas and jump up to about 40 from a stop with stock 3:55 gears :D
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
im not sure how you want to undergo this project,but i would seriously consider buying a junker 360 block and build off of it until everything is to your liking and then drop it in......
I have been looking for the last 3 months...can't find anything but LA motors for less than $500. All the Magnum motors they have are still assembled and being sold as used but running.

Having the truck down for more than a month would be a problem...I would need to have all the parts on hand, hope that everything was correcly shipped, and go from there.

Post #11
Hughes Performance sells the Magnum HD heads and also has the flow data on their website. It shows the comparison between the stock Magnum's, the R/T and the Magnum HD heads.

Check out their website
thanks, I checked out their site already but didn't know that the Magnum HD heads were for performance applications.
 

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chizzle1 said:
thanks, I checked out their site already but didn't know that the Magnum HD heads were for performance applications.
They are for performance application and they also have a thicker casting to prevent cracks.

For a 360 motor, call around to the local yards and ask for a "core" 360 motor. Around here they sell them complete for $175 - $250. Then you have a motor to strip down and send out to get done over.
 

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rage_blue
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Sorry to interup this thread, but I am in a simlilar situation. I have the 5.2 and need more power. I've never heard of the HD heads. gonna look into them. What are the logistics of swaping to a 360 block? Can the comp be reprogramed? I assum all sensors and everything else will just bolt on. And what about the flywheel? Isn't the 360 externaly balanced? My truck is also a 98. Will the emission shit still work? not that i have to ever worry about that in northern alberta.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
computer needs to be changed, you will need a different flywheel, and there are some other issues...
 

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I'll add one more problem to your list.If you go 318 to 390 stroker, You will need to get a 99 dakota rt oil pan and oil pick up tube. Your stroker crank will hit you stock 318 oil pan.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
doug said:
I'll add one more problem to your list.If you go 318 to 390 stroker, You will need to get a 99 dakota rt oil pan and oil pick up tube. Your stroker crank will hit you stock 318 oil pan.
Damn, I did not know that.
Thanks for the tip.
If I have to get a different oil pan, I'll possibly get an aftermarket deep sump pan, depending on how low it comes down (need clearance for off roading).
Good to know I can get one off a dakota R/T though.
 
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