Hemi won't turn over... - DodgeTalk : Dodge Car Forums, Dodge Truck Forums and Ram Forums
 
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#1 Old 01-24-2013, 12:50 PM
brutus442
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Hemi won't turn over...

Hi Everyone.

I'm new to forum but not a new Durango owner. My wife and I both drive 'Rango's. A 2000 4.7 and 2006 Hemi.

Recently after driving for an hour or more, my Hemi won't re-start after turning the ignition off for a brief stop. I have changed the battery and put in a high amperage battery and it ran fine for 2 days but is doing it again.

I've tried starting it in nuetral, moving the shift column up and down while the brake is on. Moving the steering wheel.

It doesn't crank or turn over at all. There's no clicking but I do hear the hum of the fuel pump during the restart attempt.

Is there something in the ignition circuit I should look at? It's got no codes stored (I checked with my OBD unit) but will then restart at random...sometimes 15 mins to 5 hours later...for no apparent reason?

Any ideas from the seasoned pro's here

P.S I'll post some pics in the pic section when I get this issue sorted

Last edited by brutus442; 01-24-2013 at 12:56 PM.
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#2 Old 01-24-2013, 12:56 PM
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Check both battery terminals.
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#3 Old 01-24-2013, 12:57 PM
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Thanks for the quick reply

Do mean for voltage drop or the physical condition?
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#4 Old 01-24-2013, 01:38 PM
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Disconnect both of them. I use a brass brush to remove any corrosion/discoloration down to fresh lead. Do that both on the battery terminals and the hook ups.

Check the wires for any fractures near the terminal connectors.

After everything is cleaned up use a pure silicon dielectric grease on the terminals.

Hope that solves your issues.
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#5 Old 01-24-2013, 01:45 PM
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Thanks Golddot,

I appreciate the ideas. I'll get back to you on how it works. My real issue is how intermittent this problem is. It's such a troublesome issue that defies logic...

Thanks for your suggestions off to do some work...
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#6 Old 01-24-2013, 08:34 PM
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OK here's a follow-up:

All batt terminals are clean and greased and voltage drop is minimal. The pulled the checked all harnesses and cround. All OK.

I'm stumped

What else could be wrong? It seems to be entirely random but there must be something inhibiting the turnover of the engine correct?

Thanks in advance
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#7 Old 01-24-2013, 08:40 PM
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Last thing that comes to mind is a fried starter solenoid, or bad ground connections. If you have a multimeter you can check the starter leads for ground. Can even check the presence of 12v to the starter with the help of your wife. Be safe and take the appriopiate electric saftey precautions.

A failing solenoid can cause intermitent faults also.

Last edited by GoldDot; 01-24-2013 at 08:49 PM.
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#8 Old 01-24-2013, 09:28 PM
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Starter relay getting ready to crap out? But, my thinking with relays, is they either work or they don't. Voltage checks while someone trys starting will go a long way. But, like GoldDot said, be mindful of the voltage and current when hanging around the starter while someone is trying to start vehicle. You might be able to find your Starter relay in the PDC and lightly touch the top, then tell someone to hit to the start position and see if you feel the relay energizing. If you can't feel it, then you need to use a meter to check it's output to the starter. Let us know what you find.
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#9 Old 01-24-2013, 09:57 PM
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Thanks for the replys gents, I really appreciate the help

I'll definitely try some of these suggestions this weekend. I'll keep you informed of what I find...thanks again!
Cheers!
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#10 Old 01-24-2013, 11:28 PM
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Cool deal.
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#11 Old 01-28-2013, 11:23 AM
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Post weekend follow up:

We'll it did it to me again. It failed to re-start at work after I arrived. I ended up getting a tow to the garage. So today (Monday) I phoned my mechanic and asked him to check the starter motor, relays and such (reading right from this post!) and he says he's unable to replicate the condition. He started it right up! No codes, no hint of problems

I took it back and sure enough it started fine while dropping my kids off to school(s). I'm at a loss to explain this now. I started searching on Dodgetalk and found this ...It's almost identical to mine.

The question is...could the same scenario be happening to my Durango that happened to this guys Ram? Is the wiring/ fusebox and relay identical in both vehicles?

http://www.dodgetalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=156406


Thanks for the ideas guys.....I'm so frustrated..
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#12 Old 01-28-2013, 01:37 PM
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Could be roughly the same issue, but hard to say. To even have a clue you need to start eliminating possible causes. You can do it yourself if your good with electrical or shell out the cash to have it looked at. That might invlove leaving it there who knows how long until it can be re-created or finding a tech familiar and willing to check the entire starting circuit.

UPDATE: Just checked the TSB's. You didnt say what year you were having the issues with but for 2000 and 2006 there is a no crank TSB. PM your email and I can send you the PDF.

2000 DURANGO

NUMBER: 08-24-00

NOTE: THIS BULLETIN APPLIES TO VEHICLES EQUIPPED WITH A VEHICLE
THEFT ALARM (VTA) SYSTEM (SALES CODE LSA).

DISCUSSION:
Part of “No Start” diagnosis on vehicles equipped with VTSS should include a verification
check of the power supply to the Central Timer Module (CTM). The CTM provides the
Powertrain Control Module (PCM) with an “OK To Start” message via the CCD bus. If the
message is not received by the PCM, the PCM will not allow the engine to start. Initially,
the engine may start and stall but will eventually not start at all. Most CTMs are supplied
battery voltage through the power door lock fuse. An inspection of the fuse should be one
of the initial diagnostic checks performed. If the fuse is operational, a verification check of
the communication system from the CTM can be performed using the DRBIIIÒ. Attempt to
communicate to the CTM. If the CTM does not respond to the DRBIIIÒ, the DRBIIIÒ will
identify a “No Response From Central Timer Module” message. A “No Response From
Central Timer Module” message may indicate that the CTM is not powered up. Please
refer to the “Communication” section of the appropriate Body Diagnostic Procedures
Manual to assist in “No Start” diagnosis due to communication problems from the CTM. In
addition, the “Vehicle Theft/Security” section will aid in the diagnosis of “No Start” issues
involving the VTSS system.

2006 DURANGO

NUMBER: 08-060-05

SUBJECT:
No Engine Crank - Loss Of Communications With Front Control Module

OVERVIEW:
This bulletin involves the diagnosis, and if necessary the replacement, of the Front Control
Module (FCM).

MODELS:
2006 (HB) Durango
2006 (ND) Dakota
2006 (WK) Grand Cherokee
2006 (XK) Commander

NOTE: This bulletin applies to vehicles built with a Front Control Module having a
module julian build date that is prior to “2765” (October 03, 2005). Julian day
“275” represents calendar day October 03. Julian year “5” represents
calendar year 2005. The build date of the FCM module can be obtained from
the module serial number (S/N) that is on the FCM part label. The FCM part
number label is located on the outside of the FCM module. Inspect the 6th,
7th and 8th digit in the module S/N to determine the Julian day. Inspect the
9th digit in the S/N to determine the Julian year. A module S/N example is:
T44HUdddy00LKN.

SYMPTOM/CONDITION:
The customer may experience a condition where the engine may not crank, and therefore
will not start. Investigation by a technician may reveal that there is a total loss of
communications between the scan tool and the vehicle, due to a loss of communications
with the Front Control Module (the “gateway” module).

Last edited by GoldDot; 01-28-2013 at 01:59 PM. Reason: TSB Update
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#13 Old 01-28-2013, 02:23 PM
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#14 Old 02-01-2013, 09:11 PM
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Follow up.

I had taken the Durango to the dealer after receiving the TSB from Goldot (Thanks again!). They checked my VIN against the TSB and say that my vehicle is not affected by that TSB (2006 SLT).

The vehicle has not given me a problem since but I'm still worried that this condition may re-appear again without any signs.

I appreciate all the advice and TSB's offered here...It's been quite a learning experience!

Hopefully I'll find the culprit, but for now...it's working (touches wood)

Cheers
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#15 Old 02-02-2013, 08:23 AM
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I had a similar issue with mine and it ended up being the altenator. If your Alt is dying it will cause all kinds of gremlins to occur. I replace mine with the highest amp rating I could get and have had no issues since.

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Mods:
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DOWNLOAD 04-06 SERVICE MANUAL http://www.mediafire.com/?hjiybtbuiyw

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#16 Old 02-04-2013, 11:19 AM
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That's one place I didn't check...thanks HEMI5PNTSVN .

A question though. If the motor won't turn over (no sound was heard at all) wouldn't that negate the altenator? Does the altenator have a signal to the PCM that prevents an engine turnover if a fault is found?

So far I've had no problems since this but the weather has warmed up a tad but even after a new battery this condition still happened twice..

I will take the altenator in and have it load tested just in case! I'm ready to try anything ..I love the truck..but hate standing by watching it get towed, only to start again at the garage

Thanks for the idea!
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