More low-end torque .. long or short tube headers - DodgeTalk : Dodge Car Forums, Dodge Truck Forums and Ram Forums
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#1 Old 11-11-2012, 07:13 AM
Tobor
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More low-end torque .. long or short tube headers

I can't remember which header type is for low end torque or higher rev horsepower.

I'm running basicly box stock 5.7 and looking more for low end grunt (Trailer towing) than hi rpm power.

Thanks

Box Stock: 2011 White Gold Ram 1500 SLT CrewCab - 4x4 - 5.7 Hemi - 3.92 LSD - Integrated Trailer Brake

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#2 Old 11-11-2012, 07:28 AM
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Definitely long tubes. Shorties are a waste of money.


2006 Ram 1500
4.7L- Gibson S/S ceramic shorties
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#3 Old 11-11-2012, 07:51 AM
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Another stupid opinion.

2009 QC Sport loaded,debadged,Borla Pro XS,LineX,Zeibart,ARE tonneau,tint, Mopar T handle,OEM flares,Vararam,JBA headers.
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#4 Old 11-11-2012, 07:58 AM
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Shorties for price and installation ease.

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#5 Old 11-11-2012, 08:01 AM
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You're right. I have shorties on my 4.7 and I lost low end but gained mid range. Could be different on the 5.7. They were super easy to install though.


2006 Ram 1500
4.7L- Gibson S/S ceramic shorties
Flex-a-lite 183 e-fan kit
Catless w/ 12279 magnaflow
Apm ram air hood w/ ram air intake
Painted grille, bumper, & handles
Painted headlights w/ Retrofitted morimoto projectors
Power slot rotors
Diablo Sport Trinity with Hemifever tune
2/5 McGaughy's drop kit
4.56 motive gears & Detroit Truetrac
Nitto 420s 285/50r20
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#6 Old 11-11-2012, 08:29 AM
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You are going to gain more tq from the longtubes, but shorties are still going to be an improvement over stock. If you dont already have a tuner, then I would go with that before headers though. A nice tune is going to give more bang for buck.
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#7 Old 11-11-2012, 11:16 AM
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For the price and install of longtubes.....IMO shortys and a torque converter (same price if not saving money) hands down is the best option. The TC will give that grunt down low and will put you in the power band where the shortys shine.

2011 Ram 1500 CrewCab w/3.92s


258mm ProII Circle D 3000 Stall Torque converter/22" Magnaflow muffler w/y-pipe mod & e-cutout, Mopar CAI, Fastman ThrottleBody/JBA Shorty Headers/180 Tstat/Catch Can/BellTech 2/4 drop w/1000 airlift kit/Powder Coated 22" Boss 338s w/Nitto 420s/Spyder HID 6000k Projectors/BushWacker "OEM" Flares/Undercover SE Tonneau Cover/Bestop Power Running Boards/Custom LED tails/Carbon Fiber Dash kit/Led Light Bar
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#8 Old 11-11-2012, 12:11 PM
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Now with JBA coming out with LT that will be a good option at a cheaper price than the ARH.

2012 Ram 2500 Outdoorsman 4X4, 4:10 gears, 305/60/18 Pro Comp Xtreme AT, ION 18x9 wheels, Magnaflow muffler, fastman throttle body, Bullydog Tuner, Edge 2600 stall TC.
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#9 Old 11-12-2012, 05:34 AM
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I had shortys on my 04 4.7 with a custom y pipe and that helped a lot with towing over stock. I had shortys on my 07 5.7 and I can't tell the difference power wise compared to my long tubes.


FRI'D 2007 Bright Silver QC 4X4 HEMI SLT SPORT. In the 13's
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#10 Old 11-12-2012, 07:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zabman View Post
Another stupid opinion.
Yep.

My jba short pipes were a big improvement.

I have no experience with long tubes though.
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#11 Old 11-12-2012, 01:36 PM
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Longtubes will always outperform shorties because they show gains across a wider rpm range. If you can swing the extra $$ and have at least a canned tune from a programmer, the longtubes will show the best results. I wouldnt run longtubes on a truck without tuning though.
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#12 Old 11-13-2012, 08:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HEMI450HP View Post
Longtubes will always outperform shorties because they show gains across a wider rpm range. If you can swing the extra $$ and have at least a canned tune from a programmer, the longtubes will show the best results. I wouldnt run longtubes on a truck without tuning though.
X2 This guys knows his stuff, but if/when you get long tubes, be smarts about how free flowing your exhaust is, I have long tubes and I dumped the exhaust right before the axle with two glasspacks, Trucks loves the high RPM but the truck feels like it lost some low end.

2006 Ram 1500 RC SB 4x4 5.7 Hemi
Current Mods:
4.56 Gears, SRT-10 Hood, Home Brew Ram Air, Pacesetter headers, Dual Exhaust dumped, 3000 Edge Stall, Diablo, 180* T-stat, Brand X Wet Kit,SP Performance slotted rotors, EBC pads, Flex a lite 183.
Awaiting install- Bilsteins shocks, Summit 20% underdrive and a Spartan cam lsa 113.
1/4... 13.3
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#13 Old 11-13-2012, 01:25 PM
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Hemi450hp-

I read somewhere, and maybe I'm not remembering right, but I'd need to add a tune if I put on any type of header because the engine would become too lean and burn itself up.

Are the tune(ers) you sell, will they work on an '11 ? I also read that performance tuners were only available for pre 11's (?)

Box Stock: 2011 White Gold Ram 1500 SLT CrewCab - 4x4 - 5.7 Hemi - 3.92 LSD - Integrated Trailer Brake

Added:
Cooper AT3 tires
Mopar Chrome Lower Body Moldings,
Mopar Fog Lights,
Mopar front & rear Skid Plates,
Leer 180 Cap w/Wilderness Package,
Rage roof mounted Cargo Basket
Weathertech over the hump floor mats
Clazzio Leather seat covers
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#14 Old 11-13-2012, 01:37 PM
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Running headers on stock tuning isnt going to grenade your motor, but having a tuner is going to allow you to get the full potential from the headers. I actually recommend that a tuner be the first mod before headers because you will get more bang for buck from it.

The only tuner currently available for the 2011's is the Diablo Trinity. Diablo actually released the tune a few weeks ago at SEMA.
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#15 Old 11-14-2012, 11:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badblackram View Post
You're right. I have shorties on my 4.7 and I lost low end but gained mid range. Could be different on the 5.7. They were super easy to install though.
I noticed just the opposite, I gained power EVERYWHERE in my 4.7 AND 5.7 for that matter.
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#16 Old 12-02-2012, 08:40 PM
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I have BBK shorties and my mid range and top end is nice. Easy installation with the shorties. Whoever just comes out and says shorties are a waste is talking to hear themselves talk. One thing to look into is emission. If you have emission in your area like I do here in Atlanta area then shorties will be the best way to go. I have a friend that has the exact same truck as me and has Dynatech longtubes and he can not pass emission, but he lives in a county here in the atlanta area that does not do emission so he does not care.

Current upgrades
- Jet 180 - Mopar Gauges- Class IV hitch - Borla Cat-Back - 4ga Dynamic Grounding - 10ga TB grounding - Sonnax trans line pressure - BBK Shorties#4009 - TheFastMan 85mm Throttle Body - SCT HemiFever Custom Tune - Magnaflow y-pipe #10748 - Doug's cutout #H1131 - K&N Intake 57-1533 - Comp 268 Cam -6.1 springs, pushrods- Summit UD Pulley, Flex-A-Lite 183 E-Fan-McGaughys shackles-Motive 4.56 gears(need install)

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1.Edge Torque Converter (2400-2600) 2. Race Ready Electric cutout 3. Detroit True Trac 4.SSBC Big Brake Kit 5. Hellwig or Belltech Sway Bar
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#17 Old 12-03-2012, 06:05 PM
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Lt will show better gains at all RPMs.

Lt can scavenge the exhaust gasses.
Shorties cannot do this.
So at all RPM the LT will perform better.

Shorties will show similar gains at some RPMs but they will never surpass the LT at any RPM.
After i installed my ARH LT headers I still had 1 of the quickest trucks out there.
You will never find a 4g ram wih shorties in the quickest ram truck thread,unless it has a converter to help it out.

Shorties have a purpose,whether for emmissions or just bang for the buck,they are there for a reason.
If I had not got such a good deal on my Lt headers I probably would have gotten a set of shorties.

2010-1500 SLt rclb 4x2-3:92 LSD.
Mods so far.
American Racing SS Ceramic Coated headers
Billy Boat SS Performance Muffler.
.Jet 180 stat./BT catch can.
Superchips transmission tune.
Diablo track tune.
Airaid dry flow intake.
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#18 Old 12-06-2012, 06:54 PM
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The main issue is you cannot compare a shorty header vs a Long Tube header set. One replaces the factory cats that are worth 10rwhp alone so if you want to compare the two you have to back the shorties up with a complete y-pipe with no cats or high flows of the same diameter as the LT.

Most do shorties for ease of install and not requiring custom tuning. JBA shorty headers are 50 State Legal and many states have adopted CARB so make sure you know your emissions laws before you spend you hard earned $$$.

I have seen where a factory motor does not gain ANY HP over the shorty & mid when you put a long tube and mid. The car was already over exhausted with the factory cam and heads. When you do a stroker motor or BIG heads and Cam you will for sure want a LT as the longer length of the runner will allow all the exhaust gases to exit the cylinder only allowing for fresh air to enter. No spent gases hurting HP only fresh air entering the cylinder.

JBA Shorty headers will make great HP increases and not have problems with tuning or WARRANTY. The Long Tube headers will require custom tuning and will VOID any warranty along with a loss in low end TQ. You will gain upper pull in the RPM but for most with 4k+ trucks all they want is LOW END.
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#19 Old 12-06-2012, 07:22 PM
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Never had LT's but my shorties combined with a Magnaflow Y pipe are way better than stock.

Scott

2005 QC HEMI * 2wd * PSB Bright Silver * AEM Brute Force Intake * Powerwire * Jetstream Scoop * Stant 14168 180* T-stat * Superchip Flashpaq 3865 w/ Trans Tuning * BBK Ceramic Shorty Headers * Magnaflow Y Pipe * Magnaflow Catback * Motive 4.56 Gears LSD * Rough Country 6" Lift *Moto Metal 951 20x10 *Nitto Terra Grapplers 305/55/20 * Alpine Audio

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#20 Old 12-06-2012, 10:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brad@JBAHEADERS View Post
The main issue is you cannot compare a shorty header vs a Long Tube header set. One replaces the factory cats that are worth 10rwhp alone so if you want to compare the two you have to back the shorties up with a complete y-pipe with no cats or high flows of the same diameter as the LT.

Most do shorties for ease of install and not requiring custom tuning. JBA shorty headers are 50 State Legal and many states have adopted CARB so make sure you know your emissions laws before you spend you hard earned $$$.

I have seen where a factory motor does not gain ANY HP over the shorty & mid when you put a long tube and mid. The car was already over exhausted with the factory cam and heads. When you do a stroker motor or BIG heads and Cam you will for sure want a LT as the longer length of the runner will allow all the exhaust gases to exit the cylinder only allowing for fresh air to enter. No spent gases hurting HP only fresh air entering the cylinder.

JBA Shorty headers will make great HP increases and not have problems with tuning or WARRANTY. The Long Tube headers will require custom tuning and will VOID any warranty along with a loss in low end TQ. You will gain upper pull in the RPM but for most with 4k+ trucks all they want is LOW END.
OK ... but there are no LT's for the 4.7L engine. Unless JBA was started making them ...

If you start a thread, be responsible and post the final outcome.


2002 Ram 1500 SLT 4x4 QC ~ 02 Ram 45RFE to Jeep GC TCM 5-45RFE Upgrade - (Nov.01) 4.7L with 85K/3142hrs, Knolton Thunder Cylinder Heads & HO Cams by Sawcut, 4.56 R&P/DTT, SRT-10 Pod w/Dynojet Wideband Commander, 2-speed manual transfer case, Clifford Security System w/Auto Start/Auto Windows, RB1 CD/DVD/NAV Infinity Sound System w/30GB iPod, Offroad Package, 33" BFG T/A KO, Mopar Rear Wheel Liners, EBC Greenstuff Roadsport Brake Pads, K&N w/Airaid Jr Modular Intake Tube, BBK 70mm Throttle Body, AIR_RAM Jet Stream Scoop, PML Diff Cover, ASP Underdrive Crank Pulley, MSD 1.65 Alt Pulley, V8 Lincoln E-Fan, 2-Speed DCC E-Fan Controller, 180 Jet T-Stat, Flowmaster SI/DO Exhaust, Tire-2-Tire Chrome Tuber Step, Line of Fire LED Light Bar, Sylvania Ultra Silverstars, $1600 Oil Pickup Tube

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