Missing, Backfire Through Intake - DodgeTalk : Dodge Car Forums, Dodge Truck Forums and Ram Forums
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#1 Old 07-15-2007, 12:12 PM
LAWMAN5050
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Missing, Backfire Through Intake

Hey everybody, I need some help.

I have a 1997 Ram 1500, 5.9L, 4X4, 85,000 miles.

Last weekend I did a complete tuneup including cap, rotor, plugs, wires, and pulled throttle body off and cleaned it.

Afterwards the truck ran great but after a day or so it started missing badly, usually when I would pull away from a stop if I gave more than a quarter thrttle or so. Sometimes when missing, it will bacfire through the intake. When its not missin, like at higher RPMs or if i don't give it much gas, it runs perfect.

I had the same problem last year and it turned out to be the MAP sensor so I got a new one and put it on yesterday but it is still doing the same thing. The first time it did this a year ago it did not throw any codes but the new MAP sensor fixed it. Exact same symptoms this time but the new sensor didn't change anything.

If anybody has any ideas let me know. I have a new coil and new oxygen sensors ordered but I dont really think thats it.

Thanks for any help.
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#2 Old 07-15-2007, 04:11 PM
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I've made the mistake of switching a plug wire once and it caused the same problem that ou are talking about. Are you getting a CEL?
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#3 Old 07-15-2007, 04:18 PM
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No check engine light. I wish it would throw a code to give me an idea where to look.

I thought maybe I got a bad cap or rotor so I went to NAPA and got new onesm and when I was changing them I checked the plug wires 3 times to make sure I hadnt crossed anything.

It acts like a sensor because it will runn great most of the time with no misses but when I accelerate from a stop or near stop andm give more than about a quarter throttle it will miss and backfire a few times and then start running great again.
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#4 Old 07-15-2007, 09:02 PM
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just a thought but could it be the Idle Air Control sensor? did you take it out when cleaning the throttle body? did you lose the rubber grommet that seals it in? or is it just hesitating on opening plunger? take it out and leave it hooked up and the turn key on engine off and see if the plunger has smooth movement? also check TPS voltage for proper reference voltage and output voltage ithinks its 5vref and .7out (at ilde)
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#5 Old 07-15-2007, 09:03 PM
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and yes they can go bad with out giving a signal they just both went bad on my truck with NO CODEs
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#6 Old 07-15-2007, 09:41 PM
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WHen I get a chance I'm going to check the IAC and the TPS.

I took the throttle body off to clean it but I didnt take any off the sensors off. Hopefully it will be something simple.
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#7 Old 07-16-2007, 08:51 AM
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Well if you took the throttle body off to clean and didnt remove the sensors i would first look at the plunger on the IAC being blocked or just 2 size 25torx bolts hold it in there, if you have a haynes, it has some test's you can do to the sensors... good luck
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#8 Old 07-16-2007, 12:39 PM
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Thanks for the ideas. I hope it is as simple as that.

If I have time tonight I will pull the IAC off and check it. I was also thinking about pulling the new MAP sensor off and making sure there isnt an obstruction in the vacum port it connects to. When I originally sprayed cleaner in the throttle body with the sensors still attached I could have actually pushed some crud into the vacum port.

If anybody else has any ideas, please post them up.

Thanks.
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#9 Old 07-19-2007, 11:47 AM
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UPDATE

I pulled the throttle body off, pulled IAC and MAP sensors of the throttle body, and reclened the throttle body. When I sprayed cleaner through the vacum port for the MAP sensor, some black crud came out. Put everything back together and went for a short test and thought I had the problem fixed.

I went ahead and put my 2 new o2 sensors on, as well as my new coil, rset the computer, and drove it for a while. The symptoms started comming back but nos as severe.

The computer still has no codes in it but I have been driving the truck alot more trying to figure this out. I hhave noticed that this isn't a miss like a cylinder dropping, its like hitting a rev limiter only at lower RPMs. Feels like the ignition is completely cutting iut and it does it rythymicaly. I guess it could be fuel cutting out but I'm not sure.

I'm starting to think that when I put the new cap and rotor on, maybe i somehow damaged the coil pickup sensor in the distributor. Does anybody know if the coil pickup could cause these symptoms?
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#10 Old 07-19-2007, 08:09 PM
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Yeah, I'm experiencing something like what you're describing, too. Coming up a short but steep hill just a bit ago I kept my foot fairly well into the gas pedal and in a steady position - the truck was surging up and down like it couldn't make up it's mind whether to go or not. Is this what you've got going on?

1998 Ram 1500 ClubCab ShortBox 4x4 360 Auto, 67K Miles, 3.90 gears, LSD, Intense Blue, Remote Starter, Pioneer stereo, 180° Thermostat, APS Precision Billet Plenum Pan (w/ Swain Tech Thermal Barrier Coating), DynoMax 3" Cat-Back, Edelbrock Performer IAS Shocks, Michelin LTX A/T Tires, Powerslot Rotors, Hawk Performance pads, Skylite Spoiler Sunroof, Rhino-Liner bedliner, Hellwig Rear Load Pro Helper Springs, Hellwig Sport Tech Rear Anti-Sway Bar, Mopar Step Tubes, RamVanMan's Steering Fix...
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#11 Old 07-19-2007, 11:33 PM
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I had the same exact problem as described originally i replaced the IAC motor and it runs like a champ amazing how one stupid little part forks up ur truck
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#12 Old 07-20-2007, 10:07 AM
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when you cleaned the throttle body did you notice an oily build up in your intake manifold? It sounds to me like the intake plenum gasket is gone....happens alot with the 360.......just happened to mine.

love to hunt and love my dodge
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#13 Old 07-20-2007, 11:49 AM
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Had problems with power loss, turned out to be the spark plug wires. Make sure the wires are crossing each other at 90 degrees. Their are TSB's on the the durango 360's relating to this not sure of the ram, but since they use the same engine, something else to look at/ search.

2012 Challenger SXT+ 220ci 5 speed, blackberry pearl, FM xxMM, diablo in-tune I1000, Carbon fiber pedal covers, 11% tint

1999 Durango SLT+ leather, 360ci 4x4, hughes plenum rebuild, superchips 3865, tow pkg, 3.55 LSD, rear tail light guard, K&N CAI, FM 50MM TB, crystal clear headlights, Torsion/shackle lift, Rancho RSX's, Pacesetter headers, dual trans & oil temp a-pillar pod, chrome deep trans pan, drilled & slotted rotors, 10 disc cd changer.

2004 Ram 1500 SLT 2WD QC LB 345ci, FM 84MM TB, slotted brake rotors, step bar, diamond plate pedals, locking gas door, tow package w/ 3.55 lsd, Hellwig LP-15, shell and carpet kit, 18% door window tint, Magnaflow 12641, Slammed1's 3" spindle lift and 2.5 coil spacer, rear lift shackles, Airraid MIT, superchips 3815, 6K front winch & custom Winch Plate, Autometer phantom trans gauge mounted in Mopar SRT A-Pillar single pod, lumber/roof rack, Rancho 9000X shocks, ATS fender flairs, 1" BL, gap guards, black grille, silver painted bezel(soon 2b white)
Next: HD rear lift bags

Gone but not forgotten 93 factory freak CC dakota lifted 4x4 318
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#14 Old 07-20-2007, 12:43 PM
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I had the spark wire problem, it ran like a bag of crap when it was arcing and it also gave a CEL. So i don't think that's his problem.
I've also replaced my plenum gasket and had the same problem LAWMAN5050 is describing. Happends after cold start, if i'm being too easy on the throttle, it acts like it will die and/or sounds like a backfire through the intake. It's very rare when it happends now and i've seem to be able to avoid it by NOT holding a consistant 10% throttle after start up.


1998 Ram 5.2L 1500 Sport
-Hughes Plenum Pan & Gasket
-Ported TB & Intake Manifold
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#15 Old 07-20-2007, 01:08 PM
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Mine didn't throw a cel until 3 days later.

2012 Challenger SXT+ 220ci 5 speed, blackberry pearl, FM xxMM, diablo in-tune I1000, Carbon fiber pedal covers, 11% tint

1999 Durango SLT+ leather, 360ci 4x4, hughes plenum rebuild, superchips 3865, tow pkg, 3.55 LSD, rear tail light guard, K&N CAI, FM 50MM TB, crystal clear headlights, Torsion/shackle lift, Rancho RSX's, Pacesetter headers, dual trans & oil temp a-pillar pod, chrome deep trans pan, drilled & slotted rotors, 10 disc cd changer.

2004 Ram 1500 SLT 2WD QC LB 345ci, FM 84MM TB, slotted brake rotors, step bar, diamond plate pedals, locking gas door, tow package w/ 3.55 lsd, Hellwig LP-15, shell and carpet kit, 18% door window tint, Magnaflow 12641, Slammed1's 3" spindle lift and 2.5 coil spacer, rear lift shackles, Airraid MIT, superchips 3815, 6K front winch & custom Winch Plate, Autometer phantom trans gauge mounted in Mopar SRT A-Pillar single pod, lumber/roof rack, Rancho 9000X shocks, ATS fender flairs, 1" BL, gap guards, black grille, silver painted bezel(soon 2b white)
Next: HD rear lift bags

Gone but not forgotten 93 factory freak CC dakota lifted 4x4 318
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#16 Old 07-20-2007, 02:07 PM
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Thanks for all the replies.

The wires, cap, rotor, and plugs are new and the wires are routed per the TSB. Except when the truck occasionally acts up, it runs good with no other missess.

I have thought about putting a new IAC on but one thing that makes me think that this is not the problem is that I have had no idle problems. Does anybody know if the IAC could cause the engine to cut out during acceleration but not have any problems with the idle?

MECGMECG
It sounds like we have a similar problem. When mine does it, it feels like the ignition or gas completely cuts out for a second. It feels like turning the key on, off, on, off while accelerating, occasionally pops through intake but not always, and clears up and runs good after 10 or 20 seconds.

In reference to the plenum, I do have a little more oil than just a misting inside the intake so the plenum may be leaking again . The weird thing is I'm not getting any pinging at all like I did last time it started leaking.

One thing I thought about is if the plenum is leaking, thats going to mees with the vacum in the intake, giving strange readings to the MAP sensor. This problem is very similar to what the truck did a couple years ago when the MAP sensor went bad. I even replaced this sensor again a couple weeks ago thinking this woulkd fix the problem but it didn't.

I'll keep checking things asd i get time and try to figure this out, Its weird that it didn't do this until immediately after i replaced plugs, wires, cap, rotor, and cleaned the throttle body.
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#17 Old 07-21-2007, 12:35 AM
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im probably reaching here cause i just found my mystery problem... but
could it be the CatConv? i read in there somewhere about power sucks for like 10 seconds and then comes back or something. could that be exaust pressure building up and the slowly leveling out?

When at a stop with Trans in drive and left foot on the break, give it some gas (a good amount) and release the pedal quickly and see if the motor dies out or RPM's drop REAL low. If so it could be a simple exaust restriction. If no, then hey, Only 99 bottles of beer on the wall.

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#18 Old 07-21-2007, 11:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LAWMAN5050
In reference to the plenum, I do have a little more oil than just a misting inside the intake so the plenum may be leaking again . The weird thing is I'm not getting any pinging at all like I did last time it started leaking.

One thing I thought about is if the plenum is leaking, thats going to mess with the vacum in the intake, giving strange readings to the MAP sensor. This problem is very similar to what the truck did a couple years ago when the MAP sensor went bad. I even replaced this sensor again a couple weeks ago thinking this woulkd fix the problem but it didn't.
Do you know of and/or remember how to do the vacuum test to check for the plenum leak? If not, you pull off the hose that goes from the driver's side valve cover to the air breather from the air breather and block that end off. Then disconnect the hose from the PCV valve. Block off the the end of that hose, too (I used duct tape on both of the hoses - works great - just make sure you use a long piece and fold it down so it can't get sucked into the intake). Fire up the truck and you should have air blowing out of the PCV valve. If you feel any suction at all instead your plenum gasket could be roached...

1998 Ram 1500 ClubCab ShortBox 4x4 360 Auto, 67K Miles, 3.90 gears, LSD, Intense Blue, Remote Starter, Pioneer stereo, 180° Thermostat, APS Precision Billet Plenum Pan (w/ Swain Tech Thermal Barrier Coating), DynoMax 3" Cat-Back, Edelbrock Performer IAS Shocks, Michelin LTX A/T Tires, Powerslot Rotors, Hawk Performance pads, Skylite Spoiler Sunroof, Rhino-Liner bedliner, Hellwig Rear Load Pro Helper Springs, Hellwig Sport Tech Rear Anti-Sway Bar, Mopar Step Tubes, RamVanMan's Steering Fix...
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#19 Old 08-12-2007, 08:47 AM
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im having the same problem with my 99 3.8 caravan. thi thread is very helpful to me thanks. ill let you know how it goes.
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#20 Old 08-12-2007, 11:18 AM
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I have noticed that a lot of people are saying to check the IAC. How do check this.
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