Timing-chain questions...[318 TBI -88] - DodgeTalk : Dodge Car Forums, Dodge Truck Forums and Ram Forums
 
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#1 Old 01-29-2007, 06:36 PM
Elajten
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Timing-chain questions...[318 TBI -88]

Hi!

I have some questions about the timing-chain in my Dodge Van 318 TBI-engine.

1. What happens to the engine if the timing chain snaps/breaks?
2. If the timing-chain is sloppy/loose, what are the symtoms on a TBI-V8?
3. The timing-gears, are they metal (i hope) or plastic ( )?
4. Does the PCM control the timing or is it manual?

(Sorry for my bad english)
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#2 Old 01-29-2007, 07:58 PM
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In order.
1. If the chain breaks it is bad news. Bent valves etc.
2. A loose chain might make noise, if it hits the timing cover. I would take the fuel pump block-off plate on the passenger side of the timing cover, then turn the engine backwards a bit. After doing this reach inside and move the chain inward and out. It should move less than 1/4". (3/8" is to much)
3. The cam gear maybe plastic teeth on a metal center, I have seen both types.
4. The PCM does control the ignition advance. It uses engine rpm and other inputs such as temperature, vacumn to sense load (MAP sensor) to calculate advance. The initial timing must be set manually.
--B-300--
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#3 Old 01-29-2007, 08:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by B-300
In order.
1. If the chain breaks it is bad news. Bent valves etc.
Damn.
2. A loose chain might make noise, if it hits the timing cover. I would take the fuel pump block-off plate on the passenger side of the timing cover, then turn the engine backwards a bit. After doing this reach inside and move the chain inward and out. It should move less than 1/4". (3/8" is to much)
How much is this in millimeters/centimeters?
3. The cam gear maybe plastic teeth on a metal center, I have seen both types.
Damn again.
4. The PCM does control the ignition advance. It uses engine rpm and other inputs such as temperature, vacumn to sense load (MAP sensor) to calculate advance. The initial timing must be set manually.
--B-300--
Ok.

Whats the service interval on the timing-chain? When is it time replace it with a new one? In kilometers please.

My Dodge is an 1988 and the engine milage is 230000km.
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#4 Old 01-29-2007, 11:10 PM
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Timing chains on those are pretty worn at 100,000 mi.
From what I understand, you can go with the Magnum engine type chain tensioner while you are replacing the chain.
Be very careful when threading the water pump bolts into the aluminum timing cover as it really sucks to crack it.

Grant
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#5 Old 01-29-2007, 11:35 PM
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Elajten -

Here's some conversions for Metric:

1 inch = 25.4 mm OR, going the other way, 1 mm = 0.03937 inch

So 1/4 inch (0.25) = 6.35 mm
and 3/8 inch (0.375) = 9.525 mm

And for distance, 1 mile = 1.6093 km OR 1 km = 0.6213 mile

So since your van has 230,000 km on it, that would be = to about 142,900 miles. If the chain has never been replaced, it is probably due for a new one.

Also, Your question #4 - The PCM controls the ignition timing and fuel injection timing, but the VALVE timing is completely mechanical - controled only by the timing chain.

Pete

Experience is something you don't get until just after you need it - Steven Wright
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#6 Old 01-30-2007, 05:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by van-nut
Elajten -

Here's some conversions for Metric:

1 inch = 25.4 mm OR, going the other way, 1 mm = 0.03937 inch

So 1/4 inch (0.25) = 6.35 mm
and 3/8 inch (0.375) = 9.525 mm

And for distance, 1 mile = 1.6093 km OR 1 km = 0.6213 mile

So since your van has 230,000 km on it, that would be = to about 142,900 miles. If the chain has never been replaced, it is probably due for a new one.

Also, Your question #4 - The PCM controls the ignition timing and fuel injection timing, but the VALVE timing is completely mechanical - controled only by the timing chain.

Pete
Ok...=( then i must pay 980$ to get this fixed =( It is very expensive in Sweden and i cantdo it myself =(

Isnt the chain use to rattle when it is worn? Have anyone break down their chain while driving? I have never read or heard about it before.

Sorry for my bad english.
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#7 Old 01-30-2007, 07:48 AM
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Don't worry about your English...I speak the language and have butchered it quite a bit on occasion.

Yeah, It would probably be a good idea to have the chain replaced and have a new crank seal and water pump installed as well.

Nate Breece

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#8 Old 01-30-2007, 08:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodgevanman
Don't worry about your English...I speak the language and have butchered it quite a bit on occasion.

Yeah, It would probably be a good idea to have the chain replaced and have a new crank seal and water pump installed as well.
Damn....even more $ that i have to pay....=(

Cant u fly to sweden och change it for me? =) I buy you a beer =)
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#9 Old 01-30-2007, 09:59 AM
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I talked with a US-car mechanic a few min. ago. He said that you dont replace the timing chain unless it rattles. He said it will hold the engines lifespan. Whats the lifeexpentency (spelling?) on a Dodge 318 V8?
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#10 Old 01-30-2007, 10:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elajten
I talked with a US-car mechanic a few min. ago. He said that you dont replace the timing chain unless it rattles. He said it will hold the engines lifespan. Whats the lifeexpentency (spelling?) on a Dodge 318 V8?
well everything breaks.... ive had a 83 truck with the 318 and it llasted all those years but if your having problems get it replaced because itll be a lot cheaper to replace the timing chain and other parts then to have to buy a new engine and have it shipped to sweeden
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#11 Old 01-30-2007, 12:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elajten
I talked with a US-car mechanic a few min. ago. He said that you dont replace the timing chain unless it rattles. He said it will hold the engines lifespan. Whats the lifeexpentency (spelling?) on a Dodge 318 V8?

No, you don't want to let a worn timing chain get to the point to where it rattles, because then it starts to damage the timing cover which is only aluminum. Besides that if the chain was allowed to get so worn that it rattles, your ignition and valve timing would be all screwed up at that point.

The reason I suggested replacing the water pump and cranks seal is because, one, the water pump has to come off when you remove the timing cover so if the water pump is original this would be a good time to replace it. Two, with the timing cover off, the crank seal can be removed and a new one installed without any problems. Putting the timing cover back on and not replacing the crank seal may cause the old seal to start leaking.

Nate Breece

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#12 Old 01-30-2007, 01:11 PM
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The mechanic should get a seal with the new timing cover gasket.
It takes only a minute or two to remove the old seal and seat the new one.
The water pump is a great idea as I am sure yours is soon to leak.

Grant
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#13 Old 01-30-2007, 02:17 PM
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First of all, my waterpump is already replaced one year ago. Second of all, does the mechanic have to de-mount the front on my car to replace the timing chain or how much must he de-mount to change the chain?
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#14 Old 01-30-2007, 03:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elajten
First of all, my waterpump is already replaced one year ago. Second of all, does the mechanic have to de-mount the front on my car to replace the timing chain or how much must he de-mount to change the chain?

Oh okay...then the water pump should be okay.

Generally the coolant will be drained as well as the oil. The radiator will be dropped out, the belts removed, the water pump removed, the harmonic balancer is removed. Then the timing cover will be removed to gain access to the timing chain.

Sometimes the alternator, A/C compressor, and power steering pump will need to be removed or moved out of the way as well.

Nate Breece

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#15 Old 02-13-2007, 03:47 AM
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I would also like to point out that if the timing chain is loose enough it is entirely possible for it to eat up part of the chain oiler tab... I speak from experience... this occured well before the point at which the chain would ever have hit the aluminum cover. You would want to replace the worn chain oiler tab so as to not accellerate wear on the new chain!
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