Report: Electric Fan install success....

Hello Van fans,

The electric fan install (and of course, the stock mechanical fan uninstall) was completed a couple of days ago, so here is the initial report: {a 'full tank MPG' report to follow next week or so....**

The install went pretty much according to the illustrated instructions provided by Flex-a-lite, for the model # 180 the 'Black Magic Extreme' unit. The cost was $ 269 from Summitracing.com.

I chose this particular model for simplicty sake, it fit the radiator easily, moves 3300 cfm, (the most powerful 16' electric fan on the market)- partly because it features a well designed full shroud.

This is very important - the full shround directs the maximum air flow through the radiator, instead of just moving hot air around the engine compartment.

[I didn't get the similar, cheaper yet nearly shroudless Black Magic fan # 150 for that reason.]

One crucial feature it has, is an adjustable thermostat that allows one to set the start up temperature of the fan. Set too low, it would run too much and prevent the engine from warming up. Basically, it must not run until the engine thermostat has fully opened, and once running, at idle, the fan runs for a minute or two, then shuts off by cooling the coolant below it's 'shut down temp'.

It's kind of funny to hear the fan run after shutting down the van - but good because all engines with soley mechanical fans 'superheat' after shutdown, and this helps cool it off quickly.

Now, it must be admitted up front that the Flex-a-lite tech guy, Bob, advised a different fan. He suggested the # 295 dual fan, but I took a different route for a reason - I wanted lower current consumption -the dual fan used up to double the amps.

In contrast, the 'Black Magic Extreme' uses 18 amps, but gives 3300 CFM, which I thought adequate to cool the engine, for the conditions which I drive in. The dual fan was also $ 100 more, to boot...

The dual fan set up is larger, a full 27' wide to cover the entire radiator (a good idea, but the flex a lite FAQ say 75 % coverage by a shroud is usually adequate....). I'm sure this will provide maximum cooling possible - this dual fan moves 4600 CFM. (If you tow trailers in 110 degree weather, you probably DO need this dual fan set up....)

But I was glad I chose the smaller unit as due to my 'double Air Conditioning set-up - that is front & rear AC' it makes things extremely tight under the hood, and I doubt with the larger fan I could have fit it, or had room to connect my custom bent brackets (the included universal brackets) to the 4 radiator support bolts.

Now to performance impressions: the van runs WAY quieter - buzzing mech fan noise is GONE. Both at idle and road speed - probably 2-4 db quieter in the cab.

The engine warms faster - no mech fan trying to cool down the engine prematurely. If you live in 'cold country' this would be a huge advantage.

Another pleasantly surprising advantage - I think having an E-fan will encourage better engine maintanance. How so ? Now the entire front of the engine is visible, formerly hidden by the stock shroud, so you can better monitor hose & belt condition and any developing leaks - this can only be a good thing !

The engine feels 'livelier' - more pep & HP as was predicted by others. We live & drive in the 4000 - 6000 ft range in the So Cal mountains & every HP helps offset the altitute losses. At sea level, the engine feels much more authoritative, eager to rev & move.

Yesterday, we did a 'heat test' drove to Palm Springs in the 95 - 100 degree heat. No problem - down the grade, the fan didn't even run. Coming back up it ran, and I was 'pushing' it with the AC on, and it started to run up the temp on the factory (unmarked) guage to the 2/3 rd mark**, but no higher.

As soon as I turned off the A/C, and hit the cooler mountain air, it dropped quickly to the 1/3 mark and got no higher even though we continued to gain another 1500' elevation.

That sounds like pretty good cooling to me ! Nonetheless, I did add a quart of that 'supercooler' (Enginekool by CRC/Napa) stuff to lower temps even more.

A good test will be to tow a trailer (2000 # plus) in summer temps and see how high it goes.

I confess ignorance on how high the coolant temps can go without it being a problem....right now I'm looking at installing a water temp guage so I can have a number reference.

If any of you consider such an installation, I'd be happy to write a more technical description including pictures. This is just my 'general impressions' report after just 200 miles / 3 days.....I admit to hoping for a 2-3 mpg improvement, we shall see.

Thanks David B. Ram Van Man

**[I wish I knew what degrees that represented -]

Cool thanks for the report Dave. Pics????

One question for you....do you have it set-up so that the fan activates when you turn the A/C on? The reason I ask is because sitting in traffic with the A/C on and the fan not turning you won't get any cool air and it could potentially damage the A/C system. Also, in winter time the compressor kicks on when you turn on the defrosters.

Im interested, keep posting your findings.

What yr and eng do u have?

Originally Posted by Dodgevanman

Cool thanks for the report Dave. Pics????

One question for you....do you have it set-up so that the fan activates when you turn the A/C on? The reason I ask is because sitting in traffic with the A/C on and the fan not turning you won't get any cool air and it could potentially damage the A/C system. Also, in winter time the compressor kicks on when you turn on the defrosters.

Cool report.....are you being punny, Nate ?

Ha Ha couldn't resist - It's a very cool report for sure ! Haven't spent 2 days and 300 clams for nothing I trust !

And yes, they advise in the instructions- strongly- that you tap into the 'hot' AC compressor clutch wire and plug into the corresponding terminal on the Flex a lite adjustable thermostat box for "auto AC on operation".

One reason I chose this fan was because of the fairly sophisticated 'fool proof' wiring box with the adj thermostat. I know Summit and the fan mfrs sell the bits and parts so you can 'piece together' a fan set up, but this seemed to make more sense for my limitations, anyway.

I'm now installing the water temp guage, ran into a snag.

I'll mention it here Nate, just the same, it's the fact that although the threads on the block drain are 1/4 NPT tapered threads (what I expected), and an adaptor adapting the guage captive fitting (3/8 NPT) to that port is on hand, it's too shallow - the sensor tip bottoms out inside the coolant jacket before the 3/8 captive nut (with sensor directly in front of it) can be threaded in !

What to do ? I need more depth that is clear...

Not sure what adapter is needed...will think on this a while....ideas ?

Originally Posted by DANVAN

Im interested, keep posting your findings.

What yr and eng do u have?

Dan, it's a 1996 B-2500, high top conversion van, with the 318 / 5.2 litre engine. Cooling system in good shape, new radiator & water pump - 105 k miles.

I'll update you all for sure. Best Regards, David

If you use an electric gauge, the sending unit isn't as long. Just a suggestion.

Thanks for the A/C tip...I'm considering an electric fan swap and was just wondering what you did for that. Thanks!

This looks like a pretty nice swap.
I am still a JY dog and would look into a set of '94 or so minivan fans as they should flow quite a bit too.
My old minivan had a huge radiator and A/C condenser.
It is good to have a Part # for the aftermarket kit though too.

Thanks for the great tech report.

Is the fueleconomy better now when you have the elextric fan? If so, i want to change fan on my 318 V8 too =)

I just did this last night. It was a piece of cake. I bought an electric fan controller from Autozone for $18 and wired a relay for the A/C. Works pretty slick. I found my original radiator was plugged up on half of the cores so I bought a new one from Autozone. They even price matched a local guy who only sells radiators so I got mine for $146. The worst part was getting the stupid fan off. I put a nice gash in my right hand when the pliers slipped.

Hey crazyinc, what brand of fan did you install ?

Yes, Elajten, there's no doubt the MPG will increase - the engine runs quieter - no huge fan spinning like giant flyswatter needlessly - for me the power increase is noticeable - the claim from the fan mfr that you gain 15-20 rear HP is likely true in some applications.

If you have this engine in a Dakota, will you even notice the increase ? But in our High Top conversion, ANY power increase is very needed !

OK part number is # 180, Flex-a-lite (Mfr), Model: Black Magic Extreme Fan

SummitRacing.com for $ 269.00

All their e-fans are on this page :

http://jeeperz.tenmagazines.com/ipg....34-x-flexalite

Yeah, Gsmagnum, the JY route is a good one - I just don't have one near me and I needed a 'seamless' install - time is precious...I had a '99 Grand Caravan and it had an e-fan that might be adaptable.

I'll report my MPG once I do a tank full.....take care all, David Ram Van Man

My friend had a 16" fan laying around that he used on his 73 Mustang. I setup the thermal switch to cut in right below the third mark and it cuts out a little below the half mark. I have a 94 B250 so I have no numbers on my guage. It looks like the same fan I bought for my step daughters Fiero. I found a 16" fan for her car on Ebay for $40 shipped. It works good.

CrazyinKC:

Very good - I admire your ability to just 'make it work'.
Did your fan include a shroud ? Did you keep the stock one ?

btw, on my '96 van the guauge is also unmarked - if the calibration is the same as yours, the 1/3 mark should be 190 F or so, according to my newly installed Sunpro water temp guage.

I guess they offer complete kits for the other of us who need a 'fool proof' can't miss install....Regards, David

The fan has a full shroud. I can give a write-up and schematic if someone would like along with a bill of matierials. I am an electronics tech so figuring out the wiring was not hard for me. I removed the original shroud and fan. It cleaned up the engine bay alot. The very first thing I noticed was how quiet the engine was without the fan. Thanks for the info on the guage. I was using a cheap thermometer and I think it was off by atleast 10 deg. F so I will tweek the thermal switch down abit.

I'd sure like to do that on my Durangos. I'll don't understand why the mechanical fan is running hard and strong when the engine is stone cold!

About 20+ years ago, I put a big Hayden electric fan (the largest one they had back then) on a 1975 Dodge Dart. It was a good installation but it really couldn't move enough air for the A/C. I added a pusher fan up front -- a bit smaller for grille clearance -- to help out and that solved the problem. The nice thing was that the two fans together actually made the A/C work better than ever, and the system would actually take another can of Freon due to the extra cooling/condensing that the fans were causing.

Eventhough the mechanical fan is spinning when the engine is cold, it's not drawing the same amount of air in when the engine is hot. It does this via a thermal clutch on the fan blades. Besides you still want the fan to turn when you have the A/C on so air is drawn across the condenser when your stopped.

I really want to do the electric fan install as well on my van.

i just did a similar electric fan install on my truck... cost me less than 230 bucks to do... and works great.

http://www.dodgetalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=102844

Originally Posted by Dodgevanman

Eventhough the mechanical fan is spinning when the engine is cold, it's not drawing the same amount of air in when the engine is hot. It does this via a thermal clutch on the fan blades. Besides you still want the fan to turn when you have the A/C on so air is drawn across the condenser when your stopped.

I really want to do the electric fan install as well on my van.

When I first crank either Durango up in the morning, there's the characteristic roar of a fully engaged clutch when the engine is revved, even during the winter with no AC (or defrost, etc.).

Within a couple of minutes it apparently "warms up" and goes into stealth mode. Both Durangos act the same.

The only thing I can imagine is that it puts some artificial load on the engine to heat it (and especially the cats) up more quickly.

I get that same sound from my fan, I kinda like it, its a sound of power.

Here's an explanation I found:

The viscous fan drive will engage the fan for maximum cooling when temperatures are high and allow the fan to operate at slower speeds when temperatures are low. In addition, at engine start-up, the viscous fan drive engages the fan for maximum cooling until the fluid in the viscous clutch can dissipate out of the clutch drive grooves allowing the fan to operate at a slower speed.

Originally Posted by DANVAN

I get that same sound from my fan, I kinda like it, its a sound of power.

Hey Dan, I know it SOUNDS like power, but what if that sound actually signifies wasted fuel & horsepower, or perhaps minimal cooling at idle w/ your AC on ? Just a thought....

I'm enjoying the quiteness of the engine at all times (save for when the e-fan kicks in....it really sounds powerful...one of the kids at church said, hey you can turn off your engine now....) and for this heavy van, the HP gain is very noticeable.

It's also reasurring to have it kick on upon shutdown of the engine to cool the engine off thoroughly.

It was over 100 in Palm Desert yesterday, and with the engine idling with the AC on it remained at about 205-210 which didn't seem bad at all - as soon as I started driving, it immediately went down to normal - 195 - and stayed there.

Added benefit: you can spot problems better now with the stock fan & shroud gone:

I discovered a front main seal leak I didn't know was there ! Another repair ! -Sigh -

Ah yes, it goes with the territory of having a 10 year old well kept van, at least I don't have lousy milage AND a
$ 600 monthly payment like my neighbors with their fancy new SUV's ......

I'll post pics when I locate my digital camera...take care all, David