new timing chain.. still runs rough! [Archive] - DodgeTalk : Dodge Car Forums, Dodge Truck Forums and Ram Forums

: new timing chain.. still runs rough!


mderosa78
01-08-2012, 06:24 PM
hey guys, i got a 2002 1500 with the 4.7l motor in it. i bought this truck with a loud noise in the motor. i do body work for a profession so i bartered with an ex-mopar tech. i fixed some rust on his truck in return he installed my new timing chain. the chain slap was gone and the motor was quiet aside from the popping and coughing. awesome deal right? so its still running real rough.. and throwing p0355 IGNITION COIL E PRIMARY/SECONDARY CIRCUIT MALFUNCTION. and p1391 NO DTC DEFINITION FOUND. so at first the p0355 wasnt popping up so i figured the cam and crank sensors were either dirty or broken. first i cleaned them. then i replaced them with auto zone parts. then being the skeptic i am, i put factory parts in.(using my discount the factory parts were only $25 more) still runs rough. so i took the truck for a 60 miles round trip, when i got home, i put the computer on and now im getting the p0355 as well as the p1391. so from the research i did, these two codes together are pointing me towards the timing being off(the timing chain installed a tooth off in one direction), a broken valve spring, a smoked hydro lifter, or last and most expensively a stuck or bent valve. also i ran fuel injector cleaner through the gas. and valve train cleaner through the oil. (the correct oil was used after the chain was done.. 10w-30) any ideas or more importantly tests i can do before calling the tech back who did the work, would be great. if i could solve the problem before i bring it back to him, that would be great. also id like to be positive if im going to question his work. thanks guys

orvtenn
01-08-2012, 07:12 PM
hey guys, i got a 2002 1500 with the 4.7l motor in it. i bought this truck with a loud noise in the motor. e p0355 as well as the p1391. so from the research i did, these two codes together are pointing me towards the timing being off(the timing chain installed a tooth off in one direction), a broken valve spring, a smoked hydro lifter, or last and most expensively a stuck or bent valve. also i ran fuel injector cleaner through the gas. and valve train cleaner through the oil. (the correct oil was used after the chain was done.. 10w-30) any ideas or more importantly tests i can do before calling the tech back who did the work, would be great. if i could solve the problem before i bring it back to him, that would be great. also id like to be positive if im going to question his work. thanks guys

A roasted lifter will cause a constant clattering sound that changes with engine speed and broken valve springs and bent stuck valves should cause a loss of compression on the affected cylinder and set a P030x cylinder misfire code (x=# of misfiring cylinder or 0 for random misfire). A compression test will rule out all valve-related issues.

mderosa78
01-08-2012, 09:11 PM
im not getting any irregular motor noises.. (besides popping and coughing) so if i do a compression test and that tests out ok, that means the only thing left is that the timing chain was installed improperly? that drives me nuts!!

zaxpw
01-09-2012, 03:47 PM
im not getting any irregular motor noises.. (besides popping and coughing) so if i do a compression test and that tests out ok, that means the only thing left is that the timing chain was installed improperly? that drives me nuts!!

that's what i would say. was it running at all before he did the new timing chain? why did you replace it? did it jump time, just flat out break, or making noise?

MikeHTally
01-09-2012, 06:19 PM
A roasted lifter will cause a constant clattering sound that changes with engine speed and broken valve springs and bent stuck valves should cause a loss of compression on the affected cylinder and set a P030x cylinder misfire code (x=# of misfiring cylinder or 0 for random misfire). A compression test will rule out all valve-related issues.No lifters in the 4.7

orvtenn
01-09-2012, 07:17 PM
No lifters in the 4.7

This is true, I didn't think about it being SOHC until this morning....

mderosa78
01-09-2012, 09:51 PM
well the 4.7 has hydro lifters.. right? but yeah it was obnoxiously loud. new chain, hydro tension-er, and slides quieted it down for sure. but yet again still running rough. apparently dodge released a TSB and a revised timing chain set up with better slides to prevent the slap that i was getting. i talked to the mechanic today and he said the computer needed to be "synced" with the with the cam and crank sensors... some dealerships say yeah they can do it. others say no such thing as "re-syncing".. i dont know what to think.. all i know is that the longer this truck coughs and sputters the more money it costs me. haha no but yeah i did the timing chain due to crazy chain slap. i might just make an appointment at the dealership to have the computer "synced" like he said, and if it doesn't fix it, have him take it apart. he said today that the 4.7 is a interference motor. is that true?

orvtenn
01-09-2012, 10:32 PM
well the 4.7 has hydro lifters.. right?

The camshaft uses followers to actuate the valves. They can be noisy but it would most likely be loud clatter in the case of the loose follower. If there's no other noise besides the "sneezes" you probably have a timing issue

dmcelhannon
01-09-2012, 11:55 PM
This is common problem with the 4.7L engine. When you did the chains, you should have replaced the tensioning adjusters as well. Without a good adjuster, the chain get slack in it and can hit the timing cover making all kinds of noise. There's a video clip in one of the old threads. Let me find the link and post it here and then you can hear and see it. If it's the same, you know what wrong.

:)

dmcelhannon
01-10-2012, 12:01 AM
Here you go. See if this helps ....

http://www.dodgetalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=337315&highlight=timing+chain

:)

mderosa78
01-10-2012, 06:41 AM
no i had an ex mopar tech do the work. all the dots are lined up right and i put mopar factory timing chain kit with all new slides, i had to buy the tension-ers extra they were around 50 a peice my cost. the chain makes no noise at all... its going to the dealer this morning to be "synced". ill let you guys know tonight what happened...

zaxpw
01-10-2012, 09:27 AM
no i had an ex mopar tech do the work. all the dots are lined up right and i put mopar factory timing chain kit with all new slides, i had to buy the tension-ers extra they were around 50 a peice my cost. the chain makes no noise at all... its going to the dealer this morning to be "synced". ill let you guys know tonight what happened...

please keep us posted. i have never heard of them needing to be "snyced" but then again, i'm no mechanic.

hemi1569
01-10-2012, 09:40 AM
They don't need to be synced, the computer sees the cam/crank sync in degrees. You can plug in the drb3 and tell if it is in time, by the degrees. It should be about half a degree pos or neg, or zero

mderosa78
01-10-2012, 08:38 PM
They don't need to be synced, the computer sees the cam/crank sync in degrees. You can plug in the drb3 and tell if it is in time, by the degrees. It should be about half a degree pos or neg, or zero

whats a drb3? i wasn't able to have it synced today due to their schedule being booked solid. the dealer did know what i was talking about. said it would only take about 15 min. the guy who installed the chain said that its impossible to install the chain wrong. if its installed wrong, the valves get bent. any truth to that?

hemi1569
01-11-2012, 09:41 AM
Drb3 is a dealer only scantool used on models ike yours(year)
As far as "syncing" a vehicle, YES it does exist zBUT iirc it only applies to camshaft driven distibutor vehicles, which yours I tale isn't... basically cam in block late 20th century gas models. Now s far a the 4.7 being interference design, I honestly can't remember

hemi1569
01-11-2012, 09:47 AM
Also it was so the INJECTORS WERE TIMED CORRECTLY, not valve timing events

mderosa78
01-11-2012, 09:19 PM
ok additional code to add to the list. code 3 of 3... p1698 no ccd messages received from pcm... hmmmm i dont understand why the dealer would tell me they could sync the timing if it isnt possible on my model... i mean it makes sense that its impossible to change the timing of the valves, any fool could understand that, but as far as spark timing. why couldnt they adjust that thru the computer? i guess we willl find out tomorrow morning.

mderosa78
01-12-2012, 08:04 PM
first problem solved. turns out the pcm needs to be changed. 440 my cost plus 2hrs diag time 200 plus 1hr install and program pcm 100... $740 to get new pcu...they better hope that fixes it. parts coming out of new york wont have it till weds.

dmcelhannon
01-12-2012, 09:15 PM
Ouch! Glad I still have a warranty.

:YO:

hemi1569
01-12-2012, 10:29 PM
I believe you can have the small v8 4.7 engine a tooth off without bending the valves as well. I cannot be sure, but i am pretty sure.