Hi Guy's i was just going over my painless wiring kit manual again and well they recommend using a minimum of 2 Gage wire from BATT to engine ground so I called painless this morning and SE if they where of they're rocker but the tech says one Gage would be even better. To me it seems like over kill but he says it makes a night and day difference from standard batt cable any thoughts or is any body using them? he also says to use it on the positive side.
3834B
03-05-2009, 02:14 PM
Seems awful big. Not sure of there reasoning. I just re-wired my truck and went with (four gauge). This is more than sufficient and bigger than OEM. Also the (four gauge) comes in pre-made lengths. Otherwise, anything larger will have to be cut and soldered.
bherder
03-05-2009, 04:19 PM
Hey Rick .... (Keep in mind that I've been called 'King of Overkill' by some buddies of mine :D ) ... There is, so far as electrical goes, there is NO such thing as overkill. Especially in our old rigs. I like to look at it as 'Don't hafta' worry about THAT one any more' kinda' thing. :D
I used 1 gauge cables the last time I made cables for my truck. With soldered copper lugs. My general 'Rule of Thumb' is, whatever Dodge used... Bump it up two gauge sizes...
rick 1978pwagon
03-05-2009, 05:34 PM
any difference Bruce as in start up and what not with one gage?
3834B
03-05-2009, 05:52 PM
A #4-AWG (American Wire Gauge) will handle about 175 continuous amps if it is routed in the open and not coiled etc. Not sure what it could handle briefly MAX I would guess 600- 800 amps.
Never done an amp draw test on a Mopar high torque starter but you would be OK with #4. Not saying bigger is not better but there would be diminished results at some point.
any difference Bruce as in start up and what not with one gage?
You would yield your biggest difference here with starter brand apposed to #4 versus #1 wire. All starters are not created equal.
Megunticook
03-05-2009, 08:17 PM
Hi Guy's i was just going over my painless wiring kit manual again and well they recommend using a minimum of 2 Gage wire from BATT to engine ground so I called painless this morning and SE if they where of they're rocker but the tech says one Gage would be even better. To me it seems like over kill but he says it makes a night and day difference from standard batt cable any thoughts or is any body using them? he also says to use it on the positive side.
What are your winters like? At very cold temperatures I think it can make a difference. I used 2 gauge on mine, including the cable from relay to starter. Not hard to crimp and solder terminals on yourself. At -20 after sitting for a week the truck will fire right up with a quick 2-3 second starter crank.
Personally, though, I think the main thing is to keep everything totally clean and tight and check it regularly.
rick 1978pwagon
03-05-2009, 10:40 PM
very cold winters and ya it was what painless says was one of the big advantages great in hot or cold weather and very important to have good other grounds as well.
3834B
03-06-2009, 05:59 AM
You could always ask yoursel this question, Why did the guy use one gauge wire when four gauge would of worked? Answer, because he is smart.:D
I heard or read that somewhere once upon a time. Really though have a look at the big picture to include starting system components as well as the charging system. Everything is only as strong as the weakest link (not trying to sound cliche). There are vast improvements out there in those areas for these old Dodge's.
any difference Bruce as in start up and what not with one gage?
Mmmm ..... Not that I've noticed..... But as Ed says, when it's -20 out it starts up just fine (Of course I keep the battery warm also)..
But this could just be funny quirk I have about making things 'battleship' tough ;) I remember though, at the time, the 1 gauge was only about a buck a foot more expensive than the 2 gauge, so I thought 'why not'? With copper prices what they are nowdays, this may not be true anymore though...
B-300
03-06-2009, 01:35 PM
Whatever size you use, the frame to body ground cable is just as important as it works the starter relay and all other grounds to the body such as the headlights and voltage regulator. I have #4 cable for the battery+, battery- (to an engine/transmission bolt) and from this point a bolt that holds the shift linkage to the frame on my 71 van.
bherder
03-06-2009, 04:44 PM
Whatever size you use, the frame to body ground cable is just as important as it works the starter relay and all other grounds to the body such as the headlights and voltage regulator. I have #4 cable for the battery+, battery- (to an engine/transmission bolt) and from this point a bolt that holds the shift linkage to the frame on my 71 van.
B300 is right on about that.... I can't tell HOW many electrical probs I've seen (And cured) when it was a simple matter of piss-poor/neglected grounding. I don't know if this is a prob with the Furd/Chebbie rigs (Because I avoid them as much as possible) but this is an area on our ol' Mopars where there can never be too much overkill.
Just to let you know how insane I am... ;) ... On my rig, I've got:
Batt cables (+ - and from relay to starter) 1 gauge cable, all copper soldered ends
Neg batt to rad support .. Intake manifold to firewall ... (Batt/grnd) leads from the alt .... A ground lead from the firewall to each front inner wheel-well ... Two wires connecting the cab to the bed (One on each side) with leads also going to the frame on each side .... All 6 gauge with soldered copper lugs .....
Yeah, way more than I need, and now you know why my local buddies call me 'King of Overkill' .... But you know what? Except for a minor brake light prob I had a while back, I've never ever ever had any electrical probs. :D ...
(Well .... a few, but that was when I first got the truck and it took a bit to make things 'right'... ;) )
3834B
03-06-2009, 07:43 PM
And don't forget the Star Washers!
Really, I would guess 90% of all electrical issues are ground related.
bherder
03-06-2009, 10:17 PM
Really, I would guess 90% of all electrical issues are ground related.
And there ya go..... (Except for that cluster-f**k of an ammeter system the Dodge Boys couldn't let go of, though... ;) )
3834B
03-07-2009, 08:09 AM
bherder, did you rewire (by-pass) your amp gauge? It's really a great move. Have a friend who has a Scout with the same set up. He's doing his this weekend.
bherder
03-07-2009, 06:15 PM
bherder, did you rewire (by-pass) your amp gauge? It's really a great move. Have a friend who has a Scout with the same set up. He's doing his this weekend.
It was already 'done' for me when I got my truck ... Of course, I had to make it 'right' though... ;)
