push rod oiling [Archive] - Dodge Talk Community Forum

stewart19777

12-28-2007, 10:23 PM

i have a 1979 w200 360(50000 orig miles). I just went through it and changed the cam and lifter timing chain, bascially a whole new top end. it was a 2bbl switched that out for a torker II intake and 600 weber carb. havent even got to drive it on the road (was a play toy new i want to drive it) and all of the lifters on the exhaust are now bad. not sure why but was wondering if any one else every had that happen. My main question is a couple of my push rods are bad now and went to get replacements and they dont have the oiler hole in them and every where ive looked says that the non oiler ones are the replacements. mine in the motor are orig and they have the oiler holes does it matter or should i keep looking. if any one has any ideas would greatly appreiact it

thanks

84 Ram

12-28-2007, 10:45 PM

The only small block Mopar engine that oils through the pushrods are the Magnums 92 or 93 to the present. You may have put the rockershafts on wrong.

stewart19777

12-28-2007, 10:51 PM

no i got them on right, was concerned that the old ones had oil holes in them and the new ones dont. wasnt sure. as for the lifters going bad i forgot to mention that the dist went right before this happed and it was backfiring something feirce. thanks for the help was just trying to clear up any doubts before i buy the new ones and there wrong

84 Ram

12-28-2007, 11:11 PM

What cam and lifters did you install? You didn't mistakingly put magnum cam and lifters in it did you, what kind of oil pressure did you have.

B-300

12-29-2007, 01:35 AM

I have seen pushrods with holes in the ends... They also fit another engine. (Not sure which)
Backfiring is a sign of a cam going flat on the exhaust side first... Improper break-in procedure could cause this to happen with all new parts, use of a roller cam with flat lifters would do this also, since the ramp angles are different.

DiverDwnPowrRam

12-29-2007, 05:26 AM

One very important thing with Hydralic lifters that many forget...preload them. If you do not know what this means...it will usually leave you with 5-6 or more bent rods. This happens because most will preoil their engines but this only fills the galleys and passages with oil. Each lifter must me "pumped up" with oil. If this is not done your rods will slap for about a minute or two but the damage has already been done. Remember for long life, depress lifters and fill each with oil...lithium the lifter feet and lifter heads (tops) and run the engine for about twenty minutes at 2000 rpms. Also now you get to also check your valves...for straightness.

Speed Dragon

12-29-2007, 11:24 AM

SB Chryslers have no preload adjustment on them, unless they are old solid cam engines (71-older).

How did you break in the cam? Also, check for worn rocker arms, they will cause it to backfire. They are known to wear right through sometimes. It sounds to me that it wasn't broken in properly and wiped out a lobe or two.

A good way to get the lifters filled with oil is to let them soak in a tub of oil for a day or so. I did this when I put the 340 cam in my 318, and they pumped up right away.

DiverDwnPowrRam

12-29-2007, 04:52 PM

PRELOAD WITH OIL...man am I the only MASTER ASE on the forum here????

stewart19777

12-30-2007, 05:42 AM

thanks for all of the responses but i did let them soak for two days and then checked them for being preloaded and they were. as for the push rods futher clean of them showed that there was no hole just looked like it. i checked the cam and the lobes were not worn any, no bent push rods. the cam i installed was a summit 218/228 dur, .441/.441 exhuast. i broke it in properly i thought. the distributer going bad is what cuased the back firing the first time. the whole cap was rocking back and forth on top. but only the lifters went bad. I did notice that the new lifters they sent me was just a hair taller maybe a 1/16 if that then stock ones i took out. i just put new push rods in it and the orginall lifters back in and ill fire it up today to see how see runs. I thought on the lifters is one of two, either just the wrong or bad lifters (because 6 exhuast and 2 intake) or the back firing put to mush pressure on the exhaust cuaseing it to push the lifter in to the cam .
\

I thank every one for there post and its a mestery to me right now just gonna put it together and drive it to see if does it agian

AMP762

12-30-2007, 04:31 PM

PRELOAD WITH OIL...man am I the only MASTER ASE on the forum here????

No,I'm also a master GM tech and a/c certified.

my card is bigger than your card :D

Speed Dragon

12-30-2007, 07:38 PM

No,I'm also a master GM tech and a/c certified.

my card is bigger than your card :DLOL

BTW, '68-up SB's are hydraulic cam engines, and do not have a hollow pushrod for oiling, they have solid pushrods.

stewart19777

12-30-2007, 09:11 PM

got the truck back together today used the stock lifters(they werent bad) and the new cam, and wow what a differnece that made. It never ran like this the first time we put everything into it. It idled right off the bat and no back fireing through the exhaust. Runs like a champ have a little bit more adjustments to do to it timing and carb but it's 3 times better than with the lifters from summit. I would like to say thanks to every one that posted with help. and to

dvrdwnpwrram you dont need to be certified to work on trucks or cars. all certifaction proves it that you can take a test.

thaanks agian

DiverDwnPowrRam

12-31-2007, 01:10 AM

Have you ever sat for the Masters test...or the tech level test...no...then you have no idea what you are talking about. My favorite ride is 22 years old, air asperated and without touching the gas pedal will fire up the first time cold, hot or 4 days sitting. Oh and also...letting lifters just sit in oil is not the sure way to pump them up, sure it works every once in awhile but it is not the sure way to do it.

buck99

12-31-2007, 07:27 PM

So what is the sure way?

Speed Dragon

12-31-2007, 07:30 PM

So what is the sure way?Pre-loading, as he mentioned earlier. I think you use a pushrod to push the lifter down while it's submerged in oil, then let it up, repeat a few times. Basically just pump the air out of it.

B-300

01-01-2008, 01:04 AM

Use extreme pressure (EP) grease on the lifter/lobes. Also 0.441" lift is close to coil bind with stock valve springs, it's also near the point wear spring retainers will hit the top of the valve guides.... I wouldn't use stock springs, I would change them out if your cam lifters didn't come as a kit with new springs.

stewart19777

01-01-2008, 06:32 AM

i didbt say that i just let them sit in oil. i said i let them sit in oil a couple of days then checked them learn to read before you jump up. and as for taking the test no i havent but iknow quit a few people who have and they dont know how build a engine any better than the old schoolers who never took it. thanks b-300 i will check into the valve springs

DiverDwnPowrRam

01-01-2008, 03:11 PM

ASE was never about how to build an engine...Its how you build an engine (or component, depending on your disapline) the right way. I was taught by old schoolers we all knew them...Smitty, Rods etc...that was back in the day when you took out the jets and doubled valve spring strength or made hemi's from 440s..from scratch.
Ok enough reminiscing with people I don't know.....GL with your project

1986w250

01-02-2008, 10:08 PM

i am ase certified and i'm not bragging about my experience. if someone else knows better, i stand corrected. you can beat your chest and get nowhere. the reason for posting on these forums is to get advise from people who know, to give advise you know, and to enjoys these beautiful machines. lets all relax and not kick each other in the nads here. i agree with priming the lifters, the same as any parts the operated off hydraulic pressure. he got it going, let him be. good luck stewart19777!

stewart19777

01-03-2008, 09:47 PM

i wont aplogize for going off about ase certified. My thought that most people on here a not certified thats why there posting. But we dont need that thrown in are face like we dont know anything. wasnt trying to start a fight was mad at the truck. i try to give my opinion and thats what i hope every one else does on here. i dont have the money or the fancy tools that alot of you guys might have but i have freinds that have been building motors and truck for a long time that didnt have them either. i agree with 86 w250 theres no reason for showing whos better than who.

I did get the truck running and it runs great motor wise. alt locked up tuesday, started today, but ill get her fixed and back on the road

thanks for all the help iam glad o found this site.

DiverDwnPowrRam

01-04-2008, 09:28 AM

No one was "Throwing certs" around...What I was attempting to do was show a right way and not just to you but to the others that get to read these forums and maybe to the others that are too shy to ask thinking their question is stupid. My chid was aimed not at you but another (and that person should have known better) and you decided to be all wounded and jump in. While I am not a Mod here, I would think that one purpose here is that when you ask a question; it is no longer your question but everyones question and that question deserves to be answered in the most safest and right way possible...now lets move on.

hoodlum38260

01-04-2008, 10:33 AM

damn isnt sarcasim wonderful

Speed Dragon

01-04-2008, 11:40 AM

I merely said it was a good way to do it, not THE way to do. Perhaps I should have said "one way to do it" instead. I didn't know you could depress the lifters by hand, every one I ever tried I could barely depress. Although, they were mostly used ones and probably already full of oil. And I thought at first that you were talking about lash setting, from the way you worded it.

stewart19777

01-04-2008, 09:21 PM

stewart19777

01-04-2008, 09:23 PM

sorry didnt post the pic here it is

Speed Dragon

01-05-2008, 10:37 AM

[Ii wasnt sure what was actually going on with the motor never had this happen before. b300 mention that .441 was pushing the stock springs to the limit, that more what i was looking for. i was pretty sure i put it together right and i ran like a champ for about to months. then it just went to crap. its running pretty good now and ill do a little more tweeking this weekend and keep a watchful ear open for lifters ticking, hopefully it dont happen agian. thanks to every one for there help

heres a pic of the beastThat's a pretty cool looking truck man. I was worried about the valve spring on mine as well, as I put a stock repro 340 4bbl cam in my 318 w/ stock '67 heads. Intake and exhaust lift on that cam is .429/.444, and I did pull 12 bent push rod out of the engine. However, I replaced them w/ good ones and had no more trouble with them. I turned it up to 5500-6k a few times, and when I pulled that engine apart later none of the pushrods were bent. So I'm not sure why the originals were bent, age maybe? But I definitely plan on using different springs next time.